Picasso also had top row realistic art, and medieval drawings were made before art advanced very much as a whole, so I don’t think that’s a fair comparison. imo, this creativity and self expression would only result in good art if the artist has good fundamentals down first.
Flippancy is not a method that leads to development.
It is exactly this that makes the forum questionable as a place for serious art discussion and it is again this “chat room” environ that allows it to flourish.
Flippancy is often regarded as an avoidance technique ie NOT TO DEAL WITH THE REALITY AND FACTS.
PS Flippancy can be enjoyable too but not if it is the norm.
It is a pity because this forum has many good aspects but in the area of the main art subsection it has become ery weak.
All the best and don’t dstart a stupid flame session please.
flip this:D
Start populating your IGNORE list.
Sven
There are both positive and negative ways to give feedback. Constructive criticism helps even the most experienced artists. Many of the best had to let go of their egos to achieve such a level.
Artists new to a toolset need that boost of self esteem sometimes. Relativity. What may be slop to a long time modeler could be quite an achievement for a new guy.
Positive, constructive criticism combined with good tips makes for a forum that promotes artistic growth. Rudeness OR being too nice to give someone honest and polite advice has the opposite effect (if they are welcoming the input).
So I agree that sometimes people over praise in art forums, but I also think people get overly critical. It’s an honesty and maturity thing. Regardless, forums are a revolution to sharing and growing as an artist. They’ll never be free of either extreme ( too 
or too 
), but they are a priceless and free resource. ZBC is one of the most active and useful out there, too. 
You and bicc39 will now be in the IGNORE list.
Wish to thank all the little people for this honor!!
What willl you do when there is no one left?
they will stroke the warm air their absent egos once occupied.
telling me true artists have no ego is like saying mickey mouse is king of Disney land. :lol:
what was this threadabout again ? ;f
“telling me true artists have no ego is like saying mickey mouse is king of Disney land”
Wtf, he isn`t?
Now you, bicc and 7 other randomly selected dudes are on my ignore list. Ill ignore you until it hurts! Ill remove you from myspace too!
but i joined the forums just to say “Wow” 
I’ll probably get a lot of flack for this, but here goes anyway:
When I started in ZBrush, it was a fairly new program. I was brand new at digital art, and as anyone who has been around ZBC for any length of time will tell you, the program was more difficult to use in the beginning. So, getting praise for even mediocre work was meaningful and felt very good. The “wow” and “great job” comments I got at that time fueled me to keep creating and provided motivation for me to get better and better.
This was a double-edged sword, unfortunately. I got used to hearing that praise, and people seeked out my advice and techniques. As the level of skill on ZBC increased, people like me (who are mediocre at best, I admit it) got less and less of that positive feedback. For me, I lost much of the joy of posting my work. Now, I rarely post anything, and in fact I rarely feel motivated to create anything period.
I know this is an immature way to react, but it is what it is. Now, when I post, I get about 95% criticism and only maybe 5% pep talk. Makes me shy away from posting at all. I am fully aware that the critiques I get are meant to make me examine my work and improve upon it, but I’m kind of a big baby and would like to hear more of the “oohs and ahhs” that I was used to getting.
I don’t think it hurts the mediocre artist to hear really good things when he/she posts a Bowling Ball with Lips. It’s like telling your 5 year old that the scribble he made really looks like a tiger hunting an octopus in space. It helps to nurture his creativity and encourages him to keep trying.
That being said, none of us is a 5 year old, and we should be able to take criticism without pouting and storming off to our rooms. I would suggest maybe tempering your comments about what can be improved with additional comments about what IS good about the work submitted.
“Yes, Johnny. I see that you have made a tiger hunting an octopus. Maybe take a look at some tiger pictures and notice how long the body is related to the length of his legs. That would make it a bit better, but you’ve captured the fierce look in his eyes very well.”
If we could all create the amazing pictures that so many ZBC members submit, I think that would be great. But we can’t, and I don’t think it’s right to discourage the Johnnies of our community by only telling them how crappy their scribble looks, or simply ignoring them altogether. The positive feedback is one of the things that has made so many people fall in love with this forum.
On a side note: Why does everyone suddenly have a Scrapbook Thread? That is so annoying. I would like to read a thread that focuses on a single project, rather than having to weed through 6 months worth of stuff that I already saw when it was first added to the Sketchbook, just to get to the new stuff.
Edit: I checked out some of Codeman’s threads, and there were alot of these “wow” and “amazing” comments there. Would you have preferred that those comments were not made? Or, do you feel that your work was greater than mediocre? I’m not saying it was mediocre, I’m just wondering where you place yourself in this debate?
Fact of the matter is, if people only commented when they had the time and inclination to give detailed, thought-provoking feedback, this would be a very quiet forum indeed.
Considering how much work flows through this site on any given day, more often than not “Great work!” is about as much energy as I can bring myself to invest in feedback. And that’s assuming I like the piece!
Even if I see a piece that looks great, I’d usually rather eat a bullet then go on an artsy-fartsy diatribe about the merits of the piece, so guess what…they just earned themselves a “wow!”
Hell, if I’m being honest, if my work weren’t mine, I probably wouldn’t comment on it.
Well said, Slosh. Nice to know some people around here know how to give good critique. 
I don’t get tired of positive and encouraging posts, but I do get tired of people being too negative, and of all the sentences that start with almost a command (“do this…”, “you should…”) or “make this the way I think it needs to be…”. I get even more bewildered when people actually change their work in reaction to comments phrased that way!
i think the artist itself
who need to be the tough judge for his/her own art work…
others are just oppinion for you to considerate.
btw THIS THREAD IS F#REAKIN GOOD its really educational.but you guys should put color on your fonts coz white is sooo last year.
Errrm, OK…! lol
Trouble is, I can barely read that purple/blue without highlighting it first! 
a good way is to find some kind words and also give honest critique.
In nearly the most pictures their you can find bad and good side, it ‘‘only’’ takes you some time.
I think the point of posting WIPs or finished peices is 2 fold - yes you want people to go - WOW, but I post for crtitics, I know I need improvement but what pisses me off is when someone offers a critique that is nothing more than a thinly vieled “You Suck”, the criticism should always be specific and constructive in order to get better.
I agree completely. I want genuine comments and help, and if people think it looks great, I don’t mind if they tell me.
I have to say, that compared to other sites (non-Zbrush), it is not that easy to get that kind of help here. I still maintain that we need a WIP part, or a noob part. There are some really talented artists here, and beginners stuff gets lost in the fantastic stuff.
I think crits should certainly be encouraged it is the only way you are really going to improve your skills if people tell you what isn’t working and long as it is done in a constructive way and not just such a part looks wrong.
If you don’t like something it is not difficult to say why. At the same time they should be telling you what does work in the piece so you know what is being done right and don’t go changing it or maybe work it into other parts of the model as well. Again why does it work. At least this way people won’t get totally discouraged and give up through just getting negative comments all the time.
Getting crits is quite tough on the forum it seems you only get a decent amount if your work is really good or if you are relatively new to the tools if you fall in between you will find crits are few an far between.
I do think having the extra sections in the forum is a good idea or people start flagging their thread titles if they want the feedback My Scuplt - CRIT ME.
At least people will know who is posting to seek advice and who is posting just to show what they are working on.
There is that much posted alot of work gets overlooked and I am guilty of just checking the thumbnails at the top unless I have a decent amount of time free. I have missed out on some pretty good work only to come across it weeks later. having the separate sections with their own thumbnails up top would help this and let more peoples work be exposed to the community.