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Going Crazy!! Need C4D/ZBrush Help!

ZBrush Usage Questions
#1

I followed the C4D Displacement Maps with ZBrush Instructions but I am not sure what I am doing wrong.

  1. Made a clean model in C4D
  2. Exported the model from C4D as an .obj file
  3. Imported the model in ZBrush

On import a message came up saying: ("This mesh contains 10 nonstandard polygons (more than 4 sides) These polygons will be converted to quads and tri-sided polygons.) I selected the OK button.

  1. Stored a MT
  2. Subdivided the mesh 4x and sculpted it.
  3. Set the subdivision level back to the lowest level (1) and turned off the MT using the “Switch” button.
  4. Selected “Create Displacement Map”
  5. Selected the displacement map from the Alpha window.
  6. Selected the “Flip V” button to flip the displacement vertically
  7. Exported the displacement map as a texture (Alpha Window > Export)

When I exported the displacement map, it gave me a choice of BMP, PSD or TIFF. I chose TIFF, but when I looked later there were three files saved one named: headaltred.bmp, headaltered.psd and headaltred.mtl but none with the TIFF extension, which is what I chose. Why is this?

  1. Went to “Preferences > Import /Export” and deselected everything in the import/export.

  2. Exported the .obj model and renamed it as “headaltered.obj”

  3. Opened cinema 4D and created a new material, then I selected the displacement channel and tried all three files: headaltred.bmp, headaltered.psd and headaltred.mtl in the displacement channel but I saw no change to the model (no displacement).

What am I doing wrong? This is so frustrating!!

Please are there any C4D users out there who can help me fix this mess! :frowning:

#2

use the riptide plugin (it’s free) for importing and exporting objects in C4d.
Cinema import function does not vibe with Z3 very well.

#3

Thanks Gary,

Unfortunately I can’t find the post, but another C4D user here in this forum get’s good results without using the Riptide plug-in so I was hoping to do the same. I don’t like to rely on 3rd party plugins if possible, but is sounds like I may not have a choice here.

What about the rest of my workflow? Am I doing this correctly?

#4

Your steps are correct. I don’t know why you don’t have a .tiff file to be found. Are you sure of the selected directory to be saved to? It’s possible that you accidentally exported the map to a different folder.

#5

Aurick,

Yeah I thought the same, but I definetly saved it to the OBJ Folder and in it there was only the following files: head.mtl, head.psd anf head.bmp, but no head.tiff file. Really Strange!

Which file do I use for the displacement. It seemed to store 3 separate files. The .psd file was 2mb, the .bmp was 3mb and the .mtl file was 16kb. They all looked the same too. Please tell me when you press the “Create Displacement Map” button, what type of file does it create?

Thanks for confirming my steps too Aurick.

I still can’t get this displacement to work though. I suppose it has to do with C4D not being able to export OBJ files properly. I don’t suppose you use C4D, but if you do do you use Riptide to import and export OBJ files to C4D?

#6

I just ran a test export of a TIFF from the alpha palette. The exported file was a 16-bit grayscale PSD. So it has the right bit depth; it’s just in the wrong format.

It looks like to get it to export the TIFF file, you need to not only select that format from the pull-down menu, but you also need to type .tif at the end of the filename. So rather than calling it “MyDispMap” and letting ZBrush tack on the .tif you should actually name it “MyDispMap.tif”. That’ll get your TIFF file.

I’ll bring this to the attention of the dev team. Thanks!

#7

OK, I think I may be slowly getting this displacement thing, but I have a few questions.

  1. Create a low poly head in C4D, then export it from C4D as an OBJ.
  2. Next, import the OBJ head into ZBrush, then follow the steps to create a displacement map, then Export the sculpted head from ZBrush as an OBJ.
  3. Open Cinema 4D. Now do I use the displacement map on the original low poly head I created in C4D or the OBJ head I exported from ZBrush or the OBJ I exported from C4D?

Q1. As far as I see it there are 3 files. Which one I am supposed to use the displacement map on?

  1. The Original low poly head I created in C4D. (C4D file)
  2. The low poly OBJ head I exported from C4D. (OBJ file)
  3. The OBJ file I exported from Zbrush

Q2. In C4D in the displacement Channel I have a few settings that I do not know what to do with. These are the default settings. Do I need to change these for my displacement to work?

Exposure: 0
HDR Gamma: 1.8
Black Point: 0
White Point: 1

Q3. I have read I need to select “Round Corners” for the displacement map to work properly in C4D. I can’t find this anywhere. Please tell me where to find this?

In Cinema 4D I loaded the OBJ Head model and then I loaded the displacement map in the materials displacement channel, but when I rendered there was no displacement. The model was unchanged.

Q4. Is it possible this is not working because I have not used the RipTide Plugin to export my OBJ model from C4D?

Thanks. Sure hope I get this soon.:cry:

#8

You do not need to export any models out of ZBrush. That’s why the workflow steps that I pointed out have you storing a morph target at the start and then switching to that stored morph target before creating the map. The map is therefore created for your original model, and can be applied to that original model in C4D.

As for your other questions, there’s a complication because C4D has radically changed and enhanced its displacement capabilities over the last few versions. Answers that are accurate for one version would be totally wrong for another. Please see the documentation for your version of C4D.

#9

Thanks Aurick,

Ok, so your saying I don’t need to export anything out of ZBrush, except the displacement map (the .tif file) and I would apply the displacement map to the original c4d mesh. Is this correct?

Can any one else can answer these questions.

Q3. I have read I need to select “Round Corners” for the displacement map to work properly in C4D. I can’t find this anywhere. Please tell me where to find this?

Has anyone created a displacement map in Zbrush for Cinema 4D R10 without using the RipTide plugin. If so could you please explain how you did it?

Thanks

#10

Have you read this?:

http://209.132.96.165/zbc/showthread.php?t=35390

#11

your big problem which I didn’t read about yet is that you haven’t fixed up your uv’s.

also note: that .mtl file is exported with your .obj - that doesn’t come from zbrush - it only comes when you export objs.

This is all you need to worry about:

Create a mesh with 4 sided polys only. If you have 3 and 5 sided just place them in areas that won’t show - this is mainly for maya but I haven’t toyed with it as much in cinema - but I got a render to work perfectly in c4d not more than ten minutes ago.

Your uv’s can NOT be overlapping. And make sure they’re all within the square in the texture editor in c4d. (i personally hate uv’ing in c4d - i do it in maya: I export a obj to maya and uv it in there then re-export the mesh back into c4d)

Once you’re model is good and ready to go - export the .obj. It will keep the uv’s which zbrush needs in order to know how to generate a good displacement map.

Bring that **** into zbrush - divide up high - do your doodlin at the highest level. Go back to the base level and go to Tool>displacement and have mode and adaptive checked on. Make 2048px map too. Then I usually make the intensity at 1 - why I have no idea - I’ve tried changing that but it never seems to change anything. So just hit the “create DispMap” button. Then it will take a moment and create it in the Alpha pallete.

Now if you did some REALLY dramatic doodling - you should also export your level 1 cage mesh back outta zbrush as a .obj. When you doodle at highest level it changes the level 1 cage mesh. So it could be too much displacement for your original model to handle. You may not need it but it’s always good to do it just in case.

Click on that map in the alpha pallette and hit “flip V” to flip it vertically (or do it in photoshop) and then export it as a .tif

In photoshop convert it to rgb - dunno if this makes a difference either but if it doesn’t work as grayscale do make it rgb.

Then finally back in c4d: with either your original mesh or exported cage mesh from c4d - apply a new material to it and on the displacement property of the material - load the displacement.tif. Have the type set to Intensity (Centered) - this is because zbrush exports displacements that 50% gray is zero displacement. Check sub-polygon displacement and bump up the subdivision level to like… 6 - or maybe 7. 6 looked good for me. And also put the strength down to like 5-10%. I also had “round geometry” checked. And that my friend should be it.

Hopefully that made sense.

cheers.
~phibs

#12

one other thing… don’t use multi displace plugin unless you’re using maya which I know you’re not… I don’t know what the correct settings for zbrush would be but I assume they wouldn’t be much different at all.

The big problem that I’ve found exporting displacements out of zbrush is this… you get these black and white high contrast jaggies at the edge of the uv borders. Whcih sometimes cause artifacting at render time on the mesh.

That multi displace 2 plugin has a sweet little property you can set that makes the displacement fix it beautifully. Pretty sweet stuff. But I didn’t use it for this c4d test I did tonight. If you want I can share you my model and c4d scene to show you how I did this as well… but I’d rather ya try it out first cause I’m a pretty busy dude and it’s kiiiinda a hassle. But I’ll do it if all else fails for ya.

I also just checked that .pdf that willshark left… you could uh… read that too haha… spells out exactly what I wrote pretty much. Although I had no idea about there being a .obj exporting problem with c4d… i dunno if that’s still buggy in r10 but I think that sounds a little silly to me. I’m just gonna be stubborn for the mean time and say “up yours” to riptide. Too lazy to dl a new exporter and learn it.

#13

docphibs,

thanks but I am still really frustrated with this. It seems whatever I try won’t wirk.

I created a clean simple mesh in C4D and exported it as an OBJ using Riptide.

(you said you need really good UV’s. Could you explain!) I was told all I need to do is make sure the model has a material when I export it as an OBJ annd it will then have an UV tag. Is this suffucient?

I then imported the OBJ into ZBrush and when I selected “Check UV” I saw a hole in my mesh AARGH! I went back to 4D and there was no hole and the normals were correct and no overlaps etc. so what gives?

Also when I export the original model form C4D using Riptide I get 2 files: a OBJ and a .mtl file. I import the OBJ file to ZBrush, but what do I do with the .mtl file.

I really desperately need this figured out quickly for a project that needs to be done.

Heeeelp! :cry:

#14

when I mean clean uv’s i mean that they’re spaced out and not overlapping each other.

and that has to be your problem. If you’re not going in to manually edit your uv’s then you’re headed down some huge problems.

Have you uv’d in cinema4d before? (i personally haven’t cause I do it in maya like I said - but it isn’t much different than any other program) Go into the BP uv edit layout and check to make sure your uv’s aren’t overlapping there. I quickly made my uv’s with a pelting tool in maya to get fast results but the traditional way is planar mapping and so on. I dunno exactly the whole process in c4d but i know there’s plenty of resources out there that show how to do it.

Picture-2.jpg

each of those groups of uv’s there are different parts of my mesh… two of them are my ears and the rest is the rest of my head. And that model that is there is an exported obj from zbrush that i brought back into c4d. But before I exported it from c4d those uv’s were just how they are showing there.

the .mtl does jack - delete it if you want. You don’t need it and it really does nothing.

and I would say screw the riptide plugin. Because I don’t know what that entails too but could be causing problems if you don’t know how to use it really well.

I’m gonna post a link here too to my c4d file just for setting and such so you can kinda look 'em over. All I did was set up the material - not much at all.

www.phibsdesign.com/c4d.test.zip

****… I forgot to put the strength down to 10 percent on the displacement in c4d… make sure you change that - my bad

cheers
~phibs

#15

docphibs,

That’s a nice pelt map you made in Maya. One thing I can’t stand about Bodypaint is it’s so pickin confusing. I honestly think they added WAY to much into it that it put’s off a lot of people. I mean I don’t know how many steps it takes you to create that pelt map in Maya, but I’ll bet it’s way more difficult to create in Bodypaint. Sorry I have Bodypaint and this is just a beef of mine.

OK, I want to paint the mesh in ZBrush so I don’t need a UV map at this point, just a UV tag right? What I was wondering is if the UV tag is created from assigning a material to the object in Cinema 4D?

I think this is all I should need (UV tag) to import the head into Zbrush

If my exported file from Cinema 4D (OBJ file) had a UV tag, then I shouldn’t have to assing an AUV or GUV in ZBrush.

If someone could confirm/deny this I would appreciate it a lot! :slight_smile:

#16

I have gotten better results by mapping the uv’s on the object prior to zbrush. The times I have used AUV or GUV in Zbrush, I frequently end up with border irregularities around the UV tiles.

#17

there’s no way that all it needs is a uv tag… you have to deal with bp and fix up the uv’s - end of story. A tag from cinema won’t solve your problem.

and doing uv’s in zbrush is a whole other mix of problems too - really bad practice and I have never gotten that to work

just gotta bite the bullet I say and fix up the uv’s manually because that’s the for sure guaranteed way it will work and not look like a pile of dung after you put so much work into it. Find resources like I said for bp - i know there’s new tools in there in r10 that make the process better although it’s not pelting.

#18

hello

i work with both c4d and zbrush. I had problems getting the dis map and texture from zbrush to c4d but i figured it out in the end.

read this trhead to see f it helps

http://www.pixolator.com/zbc/showthread.php?t=47244&highlight=cinema

I dont worry about my uvs in c4d. I assign guv tiles in zbrush and then import the model with the new uvs back into c4d.
In c4d just play with the height and strenght. Also select or rounded corners or what ever its called and give it a sub division equal to the subdivision your mesh had in zbrush.

The work flow is quite simple. Export mesh from c4d, dont worry about uvs.
model in zbrush.
poly paint (this doesnt need uvs)

then click guv tiles to create uvs
go to lowest sub divison create dis map
go back to highest sub division and do col to texture to create your texture.

I then export my mesh at the lowest sub divison, turn off all preferences.
rotate both dis map and texture 180 and flip H then export.

let me know how you get on.
If you still arnt getting what you want let me know because this work flow does work and i can go into more detail.

d